Deep Dive with Shawn

Leaving America E8: The English-Speakers - Canada, Australia, and New Zealand

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When Americans consider moving abroad, one of the first questions is often "Can I go somewhere where they speak English?" But, it's not just about avoiding language barriers—it's about finding a place where cultural references, legal systems, and core values feel somewhat familiar during an otherwise challenging transition.

Canada, Australia, and New Zealand offer exactly that comfort zone with the added benefits of universal healthcare, stronger social safety nets, and political environments that many find increasingly appealing as American politics grows more divisive. These countries consistently rank among the world's highest for quality of life, environmental standards, and personal safety. They're not utopias, but for many Americans, they represent stability in uncertain times.

The reality check? These countries operate sophisticated immigration systems designed to select newcomers based on what they bring to the table economically. Each uses a points-based framework that rewards youth, education, professional experience in high-demand fields, and language proficiency. These systems aren't random—they're strategically crafted to address domestic labor shortages and demographic challenges.

The good news: all three countries allow dual citizenship, meaning Americans don't have to surrender their US passports. The challenging news: desire alone isn't enough—you need to match what these countries are seeking. For professionals under 40-45 with college degrees working in healthcare, IT, engineering, education or skilled trades, doors open more easily. For others, creative pathways might be necessary, potentially including study, entrepreneurship, or family connections.

Featuring:

Brandon Miller

Aaron Martin

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Email: deepdivewithshawn@gmail.com

Music:
Majestic Earth - Joystock



Brandon Miller:

I'm Brandon Miller from Maple Immigration Services. If you're thinking about moving to Canada, whether as an international student, a skilled worker or with your family, I can tell you from over 15 years in the immigration business and from another 15 years of living around the world that you need a plan. We created the Immigration Blueprint to be a key starting point for any Canadian migration journey. We help you to understand how the immigration system works, what timelines to expect, what schools or career pathways are right for you, how to leverage your experience from your home country and, most importantly, how to build a life in Canada once you're here. Our Immigration Blueprint is based on a proven system where we work with you to create a personalized, realistic migration plan that sets you up for success from day one. Let's be real these are life-changing decisions for your future, so don't leave it to guesswork. Let's figure out what's possible together. Visit mapleimmigrationca or mysecondpassportca to get started on your blueprint today, because coming to Canada isn't just the beginning. Thriving here is the goal.

Shawn :

Welcome to Leaving America, the podcast series where we explore what it really means to pick up and start a new life outside the United States. For many Americans, the idea of moving abroad comes with a lot of questions, and one of the first is usually can I go somewhere where they speak English? I go somewhere where they speak English. Maybe you don't want to struggle with a new language, or perhaps you're simply more comfortable with cultures that share certain values, legal structures or political traditions. Today's episode focuses on three of the most commonly considered destinations for English-speaking Americans looking to leave Canada, australia and New Zealand. These three countries might feel culturally familiar, but when it comes to immigration, they each have distinct and sometimes difficult pathways. We're going to look at each of their systems, break down realistic timelines, what qualifications are needed and whether these countries are a realistic option for most people. I'm your host, Shawn C Fettig, and if you've ever daydreamed about trading gridlock for sheep traffic in Hobbiton, you're absolutely in the right place To stay updated on the latest episodes. Follow, like and share Leaving America on the Deep Dive with Shawn podcast feed wherever you get your podcasts, and if you've already traded American gridlock for the soothing chaos of a Sydney roundabout or need tips on avoiding funnel web spiders in US politics? Email us at deepdivewithshawn at gmailcom. All right, pack your bags. This is Leaving America.

Shawn :

For most Americans, moving abroad comes with the daunting task of learning a new language just to navigate a grocery store, let alone a job interview. But Canada, australia and New Zealand speak English. That doesn't just mean fewer miscommunications. It means you can hit the ground running both professionally and socially. But this isn't just about language. These three countries share a lot with the US in history, legal framework, pop culture and core democratic institutions. Theirs are holding at least that. Cultural familiarity can make a big difference, especially when you're trying to rebuild your life somewhere new. The electrical outlets may look different, but the political systems are recognizable. The movies are the same and you probably won't have to Google what to wear to a job interview. There are also liberal democracies with functioning legal systems, strong public institutions and, for now at least, governments that haven't been hijacked by demagogues or conspiracy theorists. That may sound like a low bar, but if you're listening to this podcast, it's probably a meaningful one. These are countries that still broadly believe in universal healthcare, gun control, climate action and science. They're not utopias, but if you've been watching American news lately, they might start to look a little bit like lifeboats. They also rank consistently high in quality of life indices, According to the OECD and the UN Human Development Index. All three boast high life expectancy, low homicide rates, good air and water quality and education systems that don't require mortgaging your grandchildren's future.

Shawn :

And, crucially, they're all countries that want immigrants, or at least certain kinds of immigrants. Their immigration systems aren't random. They're structured and they're points-based, and they actively recruit the people they think will best contribute to their societies and economies. That structure is, paradoxically, both the good news and the bad news. Here's how it works.

Shawn :

Each country has a version of what's called a points-based immigration system, designed primarily for skilled workers. These systems reward things like age, education level, years of work experience in a high-demand field, english language proficiency, job offers from local employers and family connections, or study experience in the destination country. The more points you have, the better your chances. It's a meritocratic system, at least in theory, but it also means there's no shortcut for simply wanting to move. You can't charm your way in. You have to qualify, and that's where it gets tricky If you're under 40, have a college degree, work in IT, healthcare, engineering or a skilled trade and speak English fluently, congratulations, you're a golden goose. But if you're in your 50s, work in a field that's not on the in-demand list or don't have a formal degree, then, even with the best of intentions and a deep love of maple syrup or koalas, you may face some significant hurdles. These systems are designed to filter, not just welcome, and even among the three countries the bar varies, and we'll discuss all of that.

Shawn :

These countries don't want you to move just because you're disillusioned with your own country. That might be your motivation, sure, but for them it's about what you're bringing to the table. They want residents who can fill labor shortages, boost the tax base and integrate into local communities. They're not running refugee camps for disillusioned liberals. That doesn't mean your reasons for wanting to leave America aren't valid, though, just that they're not enough on their own. You have to match your values and vision with their needs and rules.

Shawn :

One other thing these countries have in common, with the exception of New Zealand they're geographically enormous, but demographically small. Canada has more lamb than the United States, but only a tenth of the population. Australia is nearly the size of the continental US, but has fewer people than Texas. New Zealand is about the size of the continental US, but has fewer people than Texas. New Zealand is about the size of Colorado, population-wise, and far more remote. This means housing markets are tight, especially in urban centers. It also means immigration debates can be intense. A few hundred thousand newcomers in the US barely register In New Zealand. They can shift the political landscape. That's not a reason to avoid these countries, but it is a reason to approach them with care and respect. Immigration is a gift, not an entitlement. So now that we've explained why these countries are so appealing, let's get into the how, starting with our own neighbor to the north, canada.

Brandon Miller:

I think it's a pretty easy move for a lot of people. I always say that you know, coming to Canada is like it's like going to Wisconsin, Shawn, it's not really that far of a stretch. You know, we have a lot of the same products. We have a lot of the same products. We have a lot of the same culture. You know, you can still watch your favorite TV shows up here quite easily. You have access to those comforts of home. But again, there's a lot of shared values that we traditionally have had and I think culturally it's not really that big of a jump when you start jumping to other places in the world and you know, speaking from experience, it can be a little bit daunting to settle into a new, totally different culture. So I think that's one of the biggest pulls.

Shawn :

That was Brandon Miller, founder and managing director of Maple Immigration Services, which provides a wide range of immigration assistance into Canada, describing why Canada is an easy transition for Americans. For many Americans, canada is not just the closest option geographically, it's also the most psychologically familiar. It shares the world's longest undefended border with the US, the same Netflix catalog and a similarly unsettling addiction to pumpkin spice everything. It's also one of the most popular destinations for Americans looking to emigrate. But proximity doesn't equal simplicity. Canada might seem like the easy escape hatch, but the truth is it's structured, selective and increasingly competitive. That doesn't mean it's out of reach, but it does mean that before you start dreaming about poutine and maple syrup, you'll want to understand how Canada's immigration system actually works. Here's Brandon Miller again.

Brandon Miller:

The most common area that people are going to come into is an economic pathway, most likely, and that would be under something we call express entry. Express entry is a points-based system and it's generally the fastest-based system for people to come here under an economic program. Now you'll understand, like if you heard what I was saying. It's a system it's actually an application system but there's four different programs that are in there. There's something called the Federal Skilled Worker and again, for the Federal Skilled Worker, you have to have one year of skilled work experience within the last 10. So skilled work experience can be varied. It could be somebody who's you know, working as a cook or a chef, or somebody who's working as an engineer, a doctor, somebody who's working as a high level admin assistant. Those really open up a lot of different areas. But again and I don't want to get too much into the weeds there's a lot of. We have category based draws now under Express Entry, which has changed the dynamic, and the category bases allow certain professions that are in demand, and I would invite anybody who's listening if they want to explore that. Just type into Google IRCC, express Entry, category-based selection and you'll come up and you can actually see all the different options there Under Express Entry. You've got the Federal Skilled Worker Program, which is one year within the last 10. You've got Canadian Experience Class, which means you have one year of Canadian work experience within the last three. We have a Trades Program for electricians and plumbers and people that are working in the trades, and we also have P&P draws. The P&Ps also have their own application process and, again, they're really geared to occupations that are in demand.

Brandon Miller:

One of the things that's really interesting and I would like to point out to people is you can come here and get a work permit under a few different ways.

Brandon Miller:

There's LMIA-based applications, but there's also things that are covered under treaties and we have this treaty with the US called KUSMA. We call it KUSMA, I know the US calls it USMCA and this is where people can actually be transferred in. So if I just did one of these for a guy out of Boston literally 72 hours ago and they're a company in the States, they own a branch office here in Canada and he wanted to transfer in here we filled it out and he was able to get a two-year work permit and an open work permit for his spouse and they don't have kids. But if he wanted to bring his kids, they could come to school here as well, so that's actually a really advantageous area. Study permits are interesting too. If somebody wants to come and study here, there is a provision and it's only open to Americans for them to be able to come to the border and to apply for their study permit. Like right at the border, this is only for Americans.

Shawn :

At the heart of Canadian immigration for skilled workers is something called Express Entry. Launched in 2015, express Entry is an online system used to manage applications for three main federal immigration programs the Federal Skilled Worker Program, the Federal Skilled Trades Program and the Canadian Experience Class. You create an online profile and enter key details like your education, work experience, age, language proficiency, marital status and more. The system uses this information to assign you a CRS score. That's Canada's Comprehensive Ranking System. Then, every few weeks, immigration, refugees and Citizenship Canada IRCC holds a draw. If your score meets or exceeds the cutoff, you get an invitation to apply in ITA for permanent residency. Here's what you need in your profile to get you to the top of the list. Realistically, you'll want a CRS score of 470 or more to be competitive in most general draws, and hitting that number usually requires a combination of a bachelor's or master's degree and higher education equals higher points.

Shawn :

At least three years of skilled work experience, preferably in a full-time, continuous role. Strong performance on a language test, usually the IELTS, the International English Language Testing System, where high scores add significant points. And yes, even if you speak fluent English and you come from an English-speaking country, you still need to take this test, being under 35, age is a major factor. Those over 45 receive zero age points and you have to have no criminal record and a clean bill of health. Extra points can be earned for having a valid job offer from a Canadian employer. Though this isn't required, it does add 50 to 200 points, depending on the role. Completing a degree or diploma in Canada, having a close relative who is a Canadian citizen or permanent resident, and proficiency in French, even at a basic level.

Brandon Miller:

Each province or territory is allowed to come up with their own program. The provinces can select people based on what their labor market needs are. So basically what we see is they'll do a lot of in-demand type draws. So in British Columbia, for instance, they have one of the in-demand professions that just comes off my off the top of my head as an early childhood educator. There's nowhere else and there's some of the province would have that under an in-demand stream, but not much. It's basically BC. That's one job that they've seen that they want to target.

Brandon Miller:

Ontario we target a lot of like healthcare and you'll see that actually, quite frankly, right across all of the different areas. But these programs have like in-demand streams. They'll have like French streams, for instance, they could have a business or an entrepreneur stream and really there's so many differences amongst them. All the provinces have it all. There's different application procedures, there's different requirements, there's different priorities on what they're going to be selecting. Alberta, for instance, has a rural program where they're looking at basically settling people out in certain areas. We also have that on the federal level too. So again, they select the candidates based on their labor market needs.

Shawn :

That was Brandon Miller, describing Canada's shared system of immigration between the federal government and its individual provinces. If your CRS score isn't quite enough or you're willing to live outside the major cities, there's another route the Provincial Nominee Program, pnps. Canada is a federation, and each of its 10 provinces and three territories has some control over immigration. Through PNPs, provinces can nominate applicants for permanent residency based on local labor needs and demographic priorities. Think of them as regional golden tickets, though each has its own rules. For example, british Columbia might prioritize tech workers and healthcare professionals, alberta may favor agriculture and energy sector workers, manitoba often welcomes truck drivers, and the Atlantic provinces, like Nova Scotia and New Brunswick, are eager for skilled tradespeople, nurses and those with family ties. Each province maintains an in-demand occupations list and usually requires a job offer in that field, but the trade-off is that a PNP nomination adds a whopping 600 points to your CRS score, effectively guaranteeing an ITA in the next Express Entry draw. Some provinces offer direct PMP applications outside of Express Entry, though these tend to have longer processing times. Others are aligned with Express Entry, which allows faster processing once you're nominated. One of the advantages of Express Entry is speed. Once you receive your ITA and submit your complete application. The government aims to process it within six months, but the timeline can stretch if your profile isn't selected quickly or if additional documentation is required. In total, you should expect to spend about $2,000 to $3,500 in this process, and that includes the language test, educational credential assessment, government application fees, medical exam, police certificates and biometrics. This doesn't include optional costs like hiring a licensed immigration consultant, which can add another $2,000 to $5,000. It also doesn't include relocation costs, so airfare, initial housing, new furniture and all those winter coats if you're heading to Montreal or Winnipeg not included.

Shawn :

If you're interested in permanent residency or citizenship, this is where Canada shines. If you're approved through express entry or a PNP, you receive permanent residency status. This is not a temporary visa. It allows you to live, work or study anywhere in Canada, access public health care and sponsor eligible family members. You'll need to be physically present in Canada for at least 1,095 days over a five-year period that's about three years total to qualify for citizenship. Time spent in Canada as a temporary resident, student or worker can sometimes count towards this total as well, and Canada allows dual citizenship, so you won't have to give up your US passport. Once naturalized, you gain the right to vote. Apply for a Canadian passport and run for public office if that up your US passport. Once naturalized, you gain the right to vote. Apply for a Canadian passport and run for public office, if that's your thing, brandon Miller explains how to obtain Canadian citizenship.

Brandon Miller:

To become a citizen, all you need to do is be physically present in Canada within three out of five years, and then you can apply for permanent residency or sorry, citizenship. There's also a mechanism in place that you could actually do that for two years if you're here as a temporary resident, because you get credit for up to one year for half day. So what that means is is, if you stay here for two years, you're going to get a one year credit towards your three year requirement for Canadian citizenship. With Canadian citizenship, you can vote, so then you can complain about all the politicians. You hold a Canadian passport, which absolutely opens up other avenues.

Brandon Miller:

I remember when the US pulled out of the Trans-Pacific Partnership, canada kept going on that. A lot of times, when you hear about these treaties and these free trade agreements, these agreements always have worker mobility provisions buried into them, because if you're going to bring a company in, like, let's say, walmart, well, let's say Walmart's here, right, but when Walmart was leading their expansion into Canada, I'm sure they wanted to bring up a lot of their managers to make sure that that expansion went in line with the company policy. So a lot of these areas have very, very nice worker provision. So if you're holding a US passport and a Canadian passport, you can absolutely tap into that. So I say to people that a lot of times coming here, you can come here for different reasons, but there's also looking at the world and the increasing mobility that we find and the ability to have that passport to leverage opportunities, not only currently but in the future, you know, and there's so many different benefits to that.

Brandon Miller:

The other thing with citizenship that I want to point out is the residency obligation goes away. So once you have your passport, or once you become a citizen, you get to leave and you can come back in 30 years and nobody can say anything. You have a right to entry as well, which we saw during COVID, when they closed down the borders. Permanent residents didn't have that right to enter and there was people that were separated, but as a citizen, you do have a right of entry.

Shawn :

Moving to Canada isn't just about getting the visa. It's about starting over. So what does life as a Canadian newcomer actually look like? As it relates to health care, every province runs its own health care system. Most services are publicly funded and free at the point of use, though newcomers may face a waiting period, typically three months, before they're eligible, and the cost of living. Toronto and Vancouver are expensive, among the priciest cities in North America, but mid-sized cities like Halifax, Ottawa or Winnipeg offer lower housing costs and often faster integration. And the weather? Yes, it's cold, but not everywhere. British Columbia's coast has a temperate climate, while Alberta can see snow in May. So get used to layering. And despite the fact that we share a border, American and Canadian cultures are different. Brandon Miller explains what you should expect.

Brandon Miller:

I would say that we're a little bit more reserved, you know we're. I find that it's a little bit more reserved. In that respect there's a I'm struggling with that a little bit because there's it like it's the same, but there's, there's subtle differences, and the thing is, is that let's back up there, if I may? I would think that you know, again, people are a little bit more reserved. Um, sometimes, um, you know it's not people will say they won't tell you that, they're offended, so to speak. But there'll be, it'll be that, and a lot of people will smile and do that. That's one thing that I think's a little different. I'm actually the opposite. I like to tell people exactly what I think, but some people don't do that. And again, this is different for everybody and especially depending on where you are, because certain areas of the country they will tell you exactly how it is, but other places they'd be like man, man, whatever. We've got the metric system, so that might be a bit of a change for people. But again, if you're bringing your car, you can always presumably change it over quite easily. And I just think that things are a little bit more conservative, and I don't mean conservative in the US sense, but I mean conservative in terms of a little bit more relaxed in that, but there's also some norms that we generally tend to follow.

Brandon Miller:

People now, nowadays, I think, people express their opinions a little bit more, but a lot of people hold their cards pretty close to their chest, I think. So you know, you have to be mindful of that, and you know, as have to be mindful of that, and you know, as I said, a lot of people. They come here, and you can pretty much do what you want. It really takes a bit to offend people, and the only caveat to that is, though, is that we have a lot of cultures from around the world, and there's a lot of new Canadians, so you might not only be just dealing with Canadian culture. You might be dealing with culture from many different areas of the world, so you should be mindful of that as well.

Brandon Miller:

It's not only you know, the Canadian side of things. It's also different cultural norms, where you know, kind of the unspoken rule is come and do whatever you want to do, but don't infringe on somebody else's right to do whatever they want to do. So I think it's it's unique, and it you know, a lot of people would argue, especially over the last couple of years, that it doesn't work. But you know, given the current state of things, that what we're looking at, like you know Canada's really coming together, like we're still together right, we're still Canadian, and I think that that's important, where you know we have so many different cultures here and you know the inclusivity and whatnot. We don't see it as a weakness, it's more of the strength that we have, I would say. So that's something that I think is really important.

Shawn :

Politeness is prized in Canada, diversity is celebrated, government services are reliable and public radio is surprisingly listenable and it's not being defunded. And, perhaps most critically, immigrants are the norm, not the exception. Over 23% of Canadians are foreign-born. You won't be the only newcomer fumbling your way through tax season or trying to make sense of Canadian tire. So Canada is an excellent option for Americans who want something stable, structured and clear. It rewards education, planning and linguistic skill. It also expects that you'll integrate, contribute and embrace the social contract. So it may be your best bet if you work in a skilled field with global demand, you're under 40 and speak fluent English or French, you're open to living outside Toronto or Vancouver and you're okay with snow. Lots of snow Like lots of snow. So if you like the idea of constitutional monarchy, bagged milk and living in a country where political scandals involve mild improprieties instead of attempted monarchy, bagged milk, and living in a country where political scandals involve mild improprieties instead of attempted coups, canada might just be your next home. Okay, so let's talk about Australia, where the rules are a little messier but the sun is a lot brighter. Australia may have the brand of an easygoing, sun-drenched haven filled with surfers and kangaroos, but don't let the beachy vibe fool you. Its immigration system is rigorous, bureaucratic and highly strategic. And that's not a bad thing. It just means that if you want to move down under, you'll need more than just wanderlust and a backpack full of Outback Steakhouse coupons.

Shawn :

Much like Canada, australia runs a points-based immigration system designed to select individuals who are most likely to contribute to the country's economy. It's called the General Skilled Migration Program and it comprises several visa subclasses, each with its own set of rules, priorities and pathways to permanent residency. The most common skilled visa subclasses are and I'll explain these in a bit more detail later Subclass 189. This is the Skilled Independent Visa. Subclass 190, which is the Skilled Nominated Visa by a state or a territory, and subclass 491. This is the Skilled Work Regional Visa. Each of these routes requires a skills assessment, language test and a minimum expression of interest through the skill select system. You must also be under 45 years old, score at least 65 points to be considered though real-world cutoffs often exceed 80, and have an occupation on the relevant skilled occupation list. These visas lead to either immediate permanent residency, which applies to subclasses 189 and 190, or provisional residency that can transition to permanent status. This applies to subclass 491.

Shawn :

Australia's points system evaluates age. As I said, the max points of 30 are awarded if you're between 25 to 32. English proficiency high IELTS or PTE scores can earn up to 20 points. And work experience Local experience is especially valuable. Educational background More points for higher degrees or Australian education, Partner skills If your partner is also skilled, that's bonus points. And regional or state sponsorship these add 5 to 15 points depending on the visa subclass. Australia also rewards those who've studied or worked in Australia, so international students often use that as a springboard to residency.

Shawn :

Before applying, you must pass a skills assessment through the assessing authority relevant to your occupation. Each profession, whether you're an architect, physiotherapist or diesel mechanic, has its own authority and requirements. Some require academic transcripts, licensing exams or letters from past employers. This step is non-negotiable and often the most time-consuming part of the process. So let's take a closer look at the visa subclasses I mentioned. Subclass 189, the Skilled Independent Visa, does not require employer sponsorship or state nomination, and with this you get permanent residency from day one. This also makes it the most competitive as it targets high-scoring applicants in priority fields. Subclass 190, the Skilled Nominated Visa, requires nomination by an Australian state or territory visa requires nomination by an Australian state or territory. It's focused on state-specific needs like health care, education, engineering, and there's a slightly lower points threshold. If you're nominated, it requires you to live and work in the nominating state for at least two years, and this visa also provides permanent residency right out of the gate.

Shawn :

Subclass 491, the skilled work regional Visa, is for applicants willing to live in regional Australia and it's valid for five years. You don't get permanent residency immediately, but it leads to permanent residency after three years of living and working in the region and you're awarded extra points for regional commitment. The reason for this is that one of the biggest trends in Australian immigration is the push toward regional areas. The government wants to ease the population pressure on major cities and distribute skilled migrants across the country. To make this appealing, they offer bonus points for regional residency, prioritize processing for regional visas and create dedicated occupation lists for remote and rural areas. Think places like Adelaide, hobart, cairns or even towns in Western Australia. These places often offer better housing affordability and a more relaxed lifestyle, though job opportunities might be more limited, depending on your field.

Shawn :

From the day you submit your expression of interest to receiving your visa grant, expect 12 to 18 months, though some applicants get through faster. All told, you can expect to spend about $4,000 to $6,000 on this process, and that includes the skills assessment, the English test, the application fees and medical exams and police certificates. Family applications are more. They can easily exceed $10,000. And I'll note here and this probably applies to every country while a migration agent isn't mandatory, many applicants choose to hire one to help navigate the complexity as far as what to expect with your new life in Australia.

Shawn :

Once you're a permanent resident, you'll have access to Medicare, australia's public health care system. It covers GP visits, hospital care and most prescriptions. Many residents also carry private insurance for dental and vision. Sydney and Melbourne are very pricey, especially rent and groceries. Smaller cities like Adelaide or Perth offer more affordable lifestyles, and the work culture in Australia is worth understanding. Australians pride themselves on a strong work-life balance. You'll be expected to work hard, but also take your vacation. The culture leans egalitarian and informal. Don't be surprised if your manager wears sneakers and public transit is decent in major cities, but car ownership is the norm elsewhere. And of course, there's the weather. If you're tired of US winters, australia's climate might feel like a dream. Just be ready for the sun to actually try to kill you. Uv levels are no joke.

Shawn :

So if you're interested in permanent residency or citizenship in Australia, you should know that permanent residency gives you the freedom to live and work anywhere in Australia, access healthcare and public education, and it provides a pathway to citizenship. To apply for citizenship, you'll need to live in Australia for four years, including one year as a permanent resident. You'll also have to pass a citizenship test basic civics in English and demonstrate good character, so no criminal convictions. Australia also allows dual citizenship, so you don't have to give up your US passport. So Australia might be for you if your job appears on the skilled occupation list, you're under 45 and open to regional life, you like sunshine, seafood and directness, and you can handle bureaucracy without losing your mind. Australia is welcoming, but it expects immigrants to be self-sufficient, adaptable and skilled. If you can tick those boxes, it offers one of the clearest paths to permanent residency and a stable, rewarding life abroad. Okay, finally, let's talk about the quieter but no less competitive option, my favorite country on the planet, new Zealand.

Aaron Martin:

I think it is a good option, simply because there's a level of ease in terms of getting used to the New Zealand way of life. It's not, you know, you're not having to negotiate a different language. The school education systems are relatively similar, the work practices are relatively similar, so I think it's not like moving to a drastic change and relatively easy to sort of integrate into the New Zealand way of life. I think the other thing that is a little bit comforting for the people moving here from the US is it's an overnight flight to, you know, the western seaboard, so if you need to get back for family reasons or to see family members, that can be accommodated easily. So in that sense I think it gives an element of comfort for those who might have family members that might need assistance at some stage, or if you need to get back to see family or attend to other business affairs or things of that nature.

Shawn :

That was Aaron Martin, principal Lawyer with New Zealand Immigration Law, which assists people navigate New Zealand visa and immigration complexities. Describing why New Zealand is a immigration complexities. Describing why New Zealand is a good option for Americans considering a move. New Zealand is thoughtful, measured and fiercely protective of its landscape and social cohesion. It's a country with spectacular scenery, a strong social safety net and a reputation for kindness. But don't confuse laid-back with laissez-faire. New Zealand has tightened its immigration policies significantly in recent years and moving there is no longer the relatively breezy affair it once was. That said, it's still one of the world's most livable countries, with strong institutions, very low corruption, a real commitment to climate sustainability and a political culture that feels like the US before it turned into a creepy reality show. But to get there, you'll need more than an Instagrammable love of mountains and sheep. You'll need to qualify. The primary route for most foreign workers is through the skilled migrant category which, like Canada and Australia, operates on a points-based system. Aaron Martin explains.

Aaron Martin:

There is a skills category which is really geared toward people who are migrating. Based on one, I've got an offer of employment from a New Zealand company, but I have skills that are either required by that company or that are identified by the New Zealand government as nationally critical in terms of getting those skills into New Zealand, and that is very. That skill category, which has various subcategories, is very much employer and employment focused and driven. In other words, it's a key requirement that you have an offer of employment that you have an offer of employment.

Shawn :

Some of the major things to keep in mind to qualify under the Skilled Migrant category, the SMC, you must be 55 or younger, hold a job offer from a New Zealand accredited employer, be paid at or above a specific salary threshold it's currently about one and a half times the median wage and meet English language, health and character requirements. The points system itself is now simplified. Based on your occupation, skill level and pay rate, points are awarded in six-point bands depending on the type of job. Tier one shortage occupations equals big points. The salary level high earners score more. And time spent working in New Zealand loyalty matters. To be eligible for a resident visa, you need six points, which typically equates to having a skilled job that pays well or working in New Zealand for three plus years. Here's Aaron Martin describing the skilled migrant system in detail.

Aaron Martin:

It's known as the six-point skilled migrant system, and this really has a complex makeup. The objective is for a person to be able to score six points and part of your points must come from particular skill categories either occupational registration by that I mean I'm in an occupation which, under New Zealand law or regulatory requirements, necessitates me getting a form of registration with a professional body in order to perform that work. The next skill category you could choose from is qualifications. Example I have a bachelor degree from a university in the United States that compares to a New Zealand bachelor degree, or master's or doctorate degrees, etc. And the final skill category is I've got a job offer with a New Zealand employer that pays a certain salary threshold or comparable hourly rate and a person has to choose points from one of those three skill categories registration, qualification, income from job offer. The balance of points that they need to reach the six points will have to come from working in New Zealand.

Aaron Martin:

So I like to say that for some people this is a work-to-residence process and I'll give you a good example of how this works. I have a master's degree from the United States I get that is assessed as comparable to a New Zealand master's degree. I'm going to choose points from the qualification skill category, and a master's degree awards me five of the six points. How do I make up the final one point? I do that through New Zealand work experience in a skilled occupation. Experience in a skilled occupation. Once I've completed a year of experience, I then have my total six points and I can start my residence application.

Shawn :

The key takeaway here is without a job offer, your chances are near zero. This is a major departure from previous policies and the biggest hurdle for many American applicants. For most hopeful migrants, the pathway now starts with the Accredited Employer Work Visa. This visa allows you to live and work in New Zealand for up to three years, work for a specific employer in a specific role, and you can bring your partner and children under separate visas. To qualify, you have to have a full-time job offer from an accredited employer, be paid at or above the median wage, have relevant qualifications or experience and pass English language, health and character checks. The AEWV is not a guaranteed ticket to residency, but it often becomes one If your job is on the green list. So occupations with critical shortages. You may be eligible for one of two fast-track residency options the straight-to-residence visa if you're in a Tier 1 green list role, or a work-to-residence visa after two years in a Tier 2 green list role. The green list includes roles like registered nurses and general practitioners, civil structural and geotechnical engineers, early childhood teachers and secondary school teachers, ict security specialists and software developers and electricians, plumbers and some tradespeople. But even if your job isn't on the green list, you may still qualify through time spent working in-country and meeting income thresholds.

Shawn :

There are other pathways into New Zealand, though they offer alternative routes for specific circumstances. There's the partnership visa. If your partner is a New Zealand citizen or resident, you may be able to join them, provided you can demonstrate a genuine stable relationship and have lived together for 12 plus months. And there's the investor visa, and there's two main categories here the active investor plus, where you have to invest about 5 million New Zealand dollars, and the investor. One category, and this is for even higher net worth individuals. These are aimed at wealthy entrepreneurs, so they're out of reach for most people. There's also the student visa and the post-study work visa For those studying in New Zealand. There's a post-study work route that allows graduates to work in the country for one to three years, depending on their qualification level and field of study. This is a viable path for younger migrants who want to get a foot in the door, build local work experience and eventually apply under the SMC system. New Zealand's immigration processing times have improved, but expect some waiting. The AEWV is going to take about 20 to 60 days and the SMC residency is going to take about three to nine months, depending on the complexity To work your way through this process, you can expect to pay about $4,000 to $6,000 US dollars and that's going to cover the applications, the medical exams, police certificates and English testing, and then you can add on about $2,000 US dollars more if you hire an immigration advisor.

Shawn :

Living in New Zealand is many expats' dream come true, and for good reason. Healthcare is publicly funded and generally high quality. Emergency care is, believe it or not, free. Primary care, like GP visits, involves small co-pays. You'll register with a local GP and you can access subsidized prescriptions and mental health services. There's also a private insurance option to subsidize the publicly funded system. As far as work-life balance, new Zealanders value downtime. Overtime is rare and taking your holidays is not just encouraged, it's expected. New Zealand culture is similar but different from American culture. Aaron Martin explains what to expect. Aaron Martin explains what to expect.

Aaron Martin:

New Zealanders are fairly conservative in their demeanour. We don't shout our wins and our victories and sort of celebrate with the exuberance that people from the United States do, and so often people find that as sort of a bit of a thing. Just to get used to New Zealand is sort of you know, quite a. Someone described us, as you know, almost a little bit more British than the British in some ways. The other thing to get used to is also that while we speak English, sometimes we don't speak the same language and so there are different terminologies and different wordings and sayings that sometimes know catch people unawares. New zealanders are also very laid back, uh, into terms of you know issues, about timing and you know getting things done, and I think that sometimes gets confused as being sort of interpreted as maybe a level of disinterest. But it's just when you live on a set of small islands with 5.5 million people, life is a little bit more relaxed. People aren't so necessarily time-focused Sometimes. The other thing that catches people by surprise is actually one of my american clients and I were discussing this, um about two weeks ago.

Aaron Martin:

New zealanders speak very quietly and we stand a bit further apart from people and they and they sort of thought, gosh, am I? They were getting a little bit worried about gosh, am I being very loud? You know why am I? You know, compared with all these New Zealanders, I seem very loud. And I sort of pointed out that. You know, we were sitting at a cafe, outside a cafe, and, you know, because we have such a small population, you know you don't have the volume of cars, traffic, people. That means that you have to stand close to people, you have to raise your voice to make sure that you're heard, cause people to misinterpret either the body language or begin to sort of almost doubt their own conduct, as if they're sort of you know, gosh, am I doing something wrong? And it's not, it's just the environment that you're in.

Shawn :

While reserved compared to Americans, kiwis are warm, community-minded and welcoming of newcomers, especially if you show humility and make an effort to contribute. Something to keep in mind. The cost of living in New Zealand is high, groceries are expensive, especially fresh produce. Rent in Auckland or Wellington is pretty steep and buying a home is nearly impossible for newcomers due to foreign ownership restrictions, unless you gain permanent residency or citizenship. Smaller towns offer a lower cost of living but often come with fewer jobs. That said, many expats find that the quieter pace of life and proximity to nature outweighs the slower career track.

Shawn :

New Zealand has one of the world's most diverse immigration populations. One in four Kiwis is foreign-born. That's the good news. But integration is a two-way street. Americans in particular are sometimes viewed as loud, self-important or dismissive of local norms. To succeed in New Zealand, adopt a Kiwi mindset Be modest, listen more than you speak and value community over individualism. Also, be aware of the country's deep and ongoing efforts at bicultural reconciliation. The Treaty of Waitangi, signed in 1840 between the British Crown and Maori chiefs, is central to the country's legal and cultural framework. Respect for Maori language, land rights and traditions is not optional, it's essential. It's also worth noting here that New Zealand is generally a very safe country. Part of the reason for this is their strict gun laws. Here's Aaron Martin again.

Aaron Martin:

You know we made international headlines when, after an attack on a mosque in Christchurch, the government immediately banned the ability to hold and have certain semi-automatic guns. But New Zealand doesn't have a big gun culture.

Shawn :

But New.

Aaron Martin:

Zealand doesn't have a big gun culture. There are shootings, but that is just nowhere near the level that you know. It's an unusual thing, um to to to have that sort of thing happen in new zealand. People do not carry guns as of right. You must have a license that is obtained through the police. There are stringent background checks. The police come and check where you are keeping that gun. There are strict regulatory requirements as to how you can keep that gun in your house, right down to its state of readiness for use and where it's locked etc. So that it can't be just accessed by anyone in the house. So there's a lot of regulatory control around gun use in New Zealand. And gun ownership in New Zealand is probably a rarer thing, usually confined to those who legitimately participate in sports such as hunting or who are into that particular sport itself. So it's not common for people to own a gun in New Zealand.

Shawn :

If you're interested in permanent residency and citizenship in New Zealand, here are the things to consider. If you're on a temporary visa, like the AEWV, you'll typically need to work in your role for two years, meet the income and skills thresholds and apply through the residency pathways so the Green List or the SMC. Once you're granted residency, you can live and work in New Zealand indefinitely, access most public services, enroll your children in public schools and vote. After five years of legal residence, including at least 240 days in New Zealand per year, you can apply for citizenship. You'll also need to show an intention to remain, pass character checks and possibly attend a citizenship ceremony. New Zealand also allows dual citizenship, meaning you can keep your US passport. The final thing I want to touch on about New Zealand also allows dual citizenship, meaning you can keep your US passport.

Shawn :

The final thing I want to touch on about New Zealand. If you've been following along to this series, you know that my husband is from New Zealand. That's where he and I met, and in last week's episode we talked about living on an island. New Zealand is primarily two very big islands and a lot of people question if they could live full-time or permanently on an island. So I asked Aaron Martin what he tells people when they ask him about living on an island, kind of in the middle of nowhere.

Aaron Martin:

So is Hawaii, but you know it's a nice place and yeah, there those um, unusual sort of differences. New zealand is often obsessed with the weather and you know, like people from the united kingdom, and it's like, well, that's, that's what happens when, when you live on some islands in a great expanse to a country, you know that's landlocked and I'm far from the ocean, I find that an unusual thing. You know that I can't see the ocean or that I'm not close to the ocean and I don't know why that is. But yeah, you just you know I can't smell this, the, the, the salt of the sea, air and things of that nature. So yeah, you do feel that.

Aaron Martin:

But you know, guess what? Australia is only three hours by plane. If you want to, you know need a bit of time in a much more cosmopolitan, more populated place. You know New Zealand's not that far from there and you know it's easy to get to other destinations if you sort of say, well, being in New Zealand, I'm feeling a little sleepy because life's so relaxed here. I need a little bit of chaos and busyness and fun. That's a bit different, and I want to go to a large cosmopolitan center. It's not that hard to get to.

Shawn :

So is New Zealand right for you? New Zealand is a phenomenal choice if you have a job offer in a critical field, you value safety, stability and nature, you're ready to embrace humility, patience and a slower pace of life, and you're okay with a small, sometimes insular, job market. It's not the easiest country to enter, but for those who do, the rewards are deep and lasting. Okay, so three options Canada, Australia and New Zealand. Which one do you choose? Here's the truth. These three countries want skilled immigrants, especially younger ones, in high-demand fields. So if you're under 40, college-educated, skilled in healthcare, IT, engineering, teaching, construction or the trades, fluent in English and willing to live outside major cities, then you're in a great position to qualify for any of them. But if you're older, don't have a degree or don't want to work in a high demand field, it's going to be tougher. That's not to say it's impossible, but you'll need to get creative. Maybe that means retraining, Maybe it means taking a temporary job in a regional area, or it could mean trying for a student visa and transitioning later. And all three countries do offer family and partner pathways if you have family in or from the country and or if you're married to a resident or a citizen from the country. This is where talking to an immigration advisor like Brandon Miller, if you're interested in Canada, or Aaron Martin, if you're interested in New Zealand, might pay off For the right person with the right skills and mindset.

Shawn :

Canada, Australia and New Zealand can offer safety, stability and a fresh start, and they come with something else the comfort of familiarity. You won't have to learn a new language. You won't have to rebuild every cultural reference from scratch. You might even be able to watch your favorite TV shows without a VPN. But, perhaps most importantly, these countries offer a future, one that for many, feels harder and harder to find in the United States.

Shawn :

In next week's episode, we're doing a spotlight on New Zealand, where my husband, Pavel, used to live. Like I said, it's where we met, so he'll be back and we'll be chatting with a couple of our friends that made the move to New Zealand and are still living there, about how and why they did it, what they love, what they wish they'd known before moving, if they miss their home countries, and much, much more. If you enjoyed this episode or if you found it helpful, please share it with someone who's thinking about their own escape plan, and remember it's not about running away. It's about building the life you want. This is Leaving America, because sometimes home isn't where you want. This is leaving America because sometimes home isn't where you started. Thank you.

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Shawn C. Fettig

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